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102 – Get Donations with Story Telling with Randy Ford

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In this episode, David Pisarek interviews Randy Ford, a seasoned writer and storytelling strategist, about the power of storytelling for non-profits.

Randy shares insights on crafting compelling narratives that resonate with donors and amplify your mission. From understanding your audience to applying the rule of three, this episode is packed with actionable tips to help your organization connect, engage, and drive donations. Tune in to discover how storytelling can be a game-changer for your fundraising efforts!

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Episode Transcription

David Pisarek: Ever wondered how the right story can drive change and amplify your non-profit’s mission? Stick around because today’s guest is here to reveal all those secrets and more.

Welcome to the Non-Profit Digital Success podcast. I’m your host, David, and in this episode, we’re going to be talking about storytelling with Randy Ford.

Randy is a writer and storytelling strategist. He helps non-profits and membership associations build more storytelling into how they talk about themselves and how they drive change. He does that through writing, editing, video production, even event support and other services. Randy’s a former reporter and a political aide. He also performs in live personal narrative storytelling shows across the Chicago area. Randy, thank you so much for joining in today. Welcome to the show.

Randy Ford: Thank you. I’m a big fan of the show, so I’m glad to be here.

David Pisarek: We have one listener. Hopefully, we’ve got more than one listener. Right? That’s why we’re here. That’s why we’re doing this. All right, let’s jump in and get rolling with this. So it seems that we hear storytelling a lot these days, but what does that actually really mean in terms of communication?

Randy Ford: Yeah, it’s become a big buzzword, and in some ways, it’s kind of lost its meaning because I think a lot of times it will initiate in the boardroom and say, “Well, what we really need is a more storytelling approach” but that doesn’t make its way into the Slack channel. People don’t know what that means and how that affects the work that they’re doing every day.

And so I think one of the misconceptions or where people get kind of stuck is that they think storytelling means a story and that it has to be once upon a time and happily ever after. But it’s not that stories are just fairy tales.

There really are certain principles of storytelling and of stories that we’re just wired to accept as part of our communication.

And those are really the things that I try to help people focus on. You know, I heard even one time I overheard a couple of financial advisors who were talking, and one of them said, “you know, really what we are is storytellers.” And I liked hearing him say that because I liked that he had that approach to what he does. The other was a little confused about it, but in a way, “Yeah, that is what they do.”

They help their clients plan out their stories and their future generations’ stories. And so I liked hearing him say that kind of approach. He struggled a little bit to explain it to his colleague, but I think his colleague does the same thing, but just doesn’t necessarily call himself that. So, yeah, storytelling is a little loosely thrown around now, but for good reason, because it really does apply to almost everything that we do.

David Pisarek: It’s also important to kind of have a narrative. It gets your point across. It helps people maybe understand things that might be outside of their background to be able to draw comparisons or parallels so that they can really get what it is.

Randy Ford: Yeah, I’m not a science person, but there is like some science behind this that there’s a part of our brain, sometimes called the neural story net, that is triggered by anything that we take in from any of our senses. So if we read something, we hear something, and immediately before we even realize that we have read something or smelled or tasted it, it goes through that part of the brain which tries to fill in all the blanks.

And all those blanks are based on our personal experiences. Most people, I think, have an experience of what is on a cafeteria tray where they’re having it. They may go back to their elementary school days or high school or whatever, and they are filling it in. Even the color of that tray, I can picture the color of the tray that I ate off in kindergarten.

That’s different than what other people had. And so even just that little information filters based on people’s lived experiences, now that’s a really low stakes example, but I think it still shows that we are wired to build a narrative out of any information that we have.

David Pisarek: Yeah, and I think part of that is, I think there’s some key pieces to being able to tell an effective story. Call them story principles that we need to walk through. So what are story principles and how could they relate or translate rather to non-profits and charities?

Randy Ford: Yeah, there are these building blocks of stories, if you will. You know, I said it doesn’t have to be once upon a time that something happens and then happily ever after, but it kind of does.

I mean, there’s a beginning and middle and end to stories, but that can be “you know, this is who we are as an organization. This is what we’re doing.” And the ending could be the call to action. “You know, we need your support in” whatever way.

A big one is the rule of threes. We have been wired since we very first heard stories growing up, and most of us, at least in Western culture, take in information.

In Greece, you know, you have three little pigs, three bears, Harry, Ron, and Hermione, in Harry Potter. So that is a way that people take in information and learn from it. So that’s a story principle that I think is important.

Anytime we’re talking, whether we’re telling a story, writing an email, or giving a speech, it’s just a good communication role. So organizations can learn from those things, can learn from the visuals that bring people to understand and build a narrative.

And then also, the big thing about storytelling is the audience.

Knowing who the audience is, I would say is an important story principle.

So that you know who you’re speaking to, and that feels like a given. But I think it is a step that often gets skipped. Or people think that they understand their audience and may maybe haven’t really taken the time to understand how that audience is going to receive something.

David Pisarek: Few things that you mentioned there that really kind of resonate with me. So, like this rule of threes, it’s true in art, right? Where you’ve got, like, the top, the middle, the bottom you want to frame subjects on, like where that kind of intersect works in business if you’re trying to sell something, could you price anchoring? Right.

So if you approach somebody and say, “Hey, there are four options for you,” it’s hard to pick. If you approach them and say, “Hey, we’ve got three options for you,” they’re going to tend to gravitate to the middle option.

So it can kind of help direct people in those types of ways. And I think it’s an interesting point to go, yeah, these are the things that we need to consider when we’re putting together our story.

Randy Ford: Absolutely. And you’re right. The comparison to how that’s done in art and graphic design and other visual arts is exactly how I picture it when I’m thinking about it in terms of a story or any kind of written content. You’re right. Three is easier to digest than four.

And it also feels, from a sales perspective, better than. And 2, sometimes I know designers often will do this. I’ve done this when working with a client. You know, you come up with three logo designs, and you put your favourite in the middle because you want that to get picked.

That’s just another way that kind of the brain goes through that rule of three, and that’s not tricking necessarily what’s the best look for your clients. Yeah.

David Pisarek: So if you’re presenting something to your boss, your director, your vp, the board of directors, to get approval on something, maybe don’t go to them with one thing, go to them with three.

So, anybody listening to this, try it next time. You’ve got something to present. Go. “All right, here are three options for you.” See what happens. Leave a comment on our podcast page on this episode. Let us know what worked, what didn’t work, that kind of thing.

Randy Ford: Yeah, that would be cool to say.

David Pisarek: Yeah, for sure. The other thing that I wanted to mention, they talked about, and I’ve mentioned this on some other episodes, is really knowing the audience.

You’ve got to build out personas, avatars, characters, whatever it is that you want to call it, but it’s the three of them combined. I’m saying three because we were just talking about three. But know who your main audience is that you’re trying to connect with. That should probably cover 80-85% of your audience.

You’re not going to be able to get everybody because there are going to be edge cases or, you know, outside of the norm.

But knowing who it is you’re going to talk to or speak to or write to design for or promote something to will help you do it in a more effective way.

Randy Ford: Yeah, there’s a concept called the storytelling triangle. Well, you know, if you picture a triangle, at the very top point is the storyteller or the messenger, the writer, the designer, whatever; it’s you as the person, as the communicator. And any form, in my mind, it’s the bottom right is the story.

And that’s what you have developed and have hopefully worked very hard to fine tune. And you have complete control over that.

So, you have a hundred percent control over yourself as the communicator. You have a 100% chance, let’s hope, of nailing the story.

But the other point of that triangle is the audience. And the truth is you have zero control over how they’re going to receive something.

So the best we can do is try to meet them halfway by learning who they are. Like you said, going through an avatar exercise is amazing. If there’s, you know, opt to do focus groups or surveys help to some extent, you really have to know that audience the best you can, because otherwise we’re kind of being vulnerable, putting stuff out there without knowing exactly how it’s going to be taken.

And we just kind of have to do the best we can to know who they are and what they want and how they will respond.

David Pisarek: What are some steps that non-profits or charities can take with regard to that?

Randy Ford: I think one of my favorites is focus groups, and that’s easy to do now, but now that so many people are familiar with zoom, to get a group of people together and just talk through it and get some ideas. You know, of course, you want a cross-section of the audience you’re trying to reach. You know, I said surveys. We all know that you don’t get a great response from surveys.

And it may be from people who are kind of all over the board, but I think direct conversations and then from that, developing those avatars. For me, there’s a communications project that I do, a daily newsletter that I write for an association. And because I have been able to go to this association’s events over the years, I have a pretty good idea of the cross-section of their membership. And I have about five people.

I have in mind that in every story that I write, those people kind of pop into my head, and I think, “Oh, you know, they already know this abbreviation. I don’t need to explain it because I have picked those people and not consciously not stalking them.” But I do think, you know, this might be something where she doesn’t know how this works.

I need to put in an explainer that’s interesting.

David Pisarek: So we know content can really resonate. I know from my experience, both with clients, with our audience that we promote to, and the folks that our clients are trying to connect to, as well as me personally, when I get content, I think people’s attention spans are very different now than they were pre Covid, let alone 10, 15, 20 years ago.

People want things more, they want it faster, they want it quicker. Do you have any thoughts on how non-profits can still get their point across, but get it across in a way that will hit people and grab them faster?

Randy Ford: I think this is where it is important to be concise and also visual. I used to work for a member of Congress for 10 years, and I can tell you if someone was coming in with something that they wanted us to consider voting for, voting against, or anything else, we really didn’t have time to read a 40-page white paper as much as we would love to, but there just wasn’t time for that.

And what is more effective is a one pager that is well designed so that it shows that there’s some professionalism there that has graphics, especially if it has people always being able to see real people.

And then for that matter, the people who came in would be important. You know, being able to put a face and a name and a story from our district, one of our constituents who has been affected by this, to come in and talk about it makes a big difference.

So even thinking about who your storyteller is, who is your messenger, who can tell your story the best, and maybe that’s from their own perspective, is a way to get stuff across. And whether that’s meeting and talking in person or getting them on video or including them in some kind of reefer document that needs to be shared.

Especially, you know, if there’s a direct mail campaign, for example, I would say fewer words, more pictures.

David Pisarek: I think that’s really a smart way of approaching it. This leads to a topic that I wanted to talk with you about, which is the visual side of stuff. So we know that the saying is a picture tells a thousand words.

I’ve gone on to say a video tells a million words because I think a 30-second clip or a 20-second clip can get far more in-depth and get a lot more information. Content, the story pulled across.

I guess the question for you is, beyond the written content, which is primarily what we’ve been talking about here, how can visual creators adopt storytelling principles?

Randy Ford: I think it’s really in their nature. Anyway, as we talked earlier about the role of freeze, although I did talk to one graphic designer who’s a good graphic designer and had never heard of that, so. But I think most haven’t and even she probably has it instinctively. But it’s about telling the story, even just through the photos that you select and the design being, you know, thinking again about the audience, what font size, all of those things that designers have to decide, but they’re not deciding that.

The most successful and effective ones are not deciding just on how it looks to them, but they’re deciding it on how it’s going to look to the other person. You know, again, the other part of that triangle, the audience that we are trying to get things to appeal to.

David Pisarek: I was just talking with a client yesterday and we were talking about fonts and how even the style of font can convey how professional an organization is or isn’t and can convey subtleties about the organization, the personality of it.

And, you know, there are psychological things at play, just like there are in the words that we use and the visual cues that we have in our brand and how we put ourselves forward. So I think that’s an important part is, you know, “how does this actually look? Is it hitting the mark? Is this what the 2, 3, 4, 5 personas would consider something intentional and worthy of their attention?”

Randy Ford: Yeah, it really comes through when something is more professional. Hope this isn’t going to offend anybody, but when I’ve been in positions to see lots of resumes, for example, even if it’s not for a visual Arts kind of position. It still makes a difference to me as the reviewer.

Now, maybe I’m more focused on it than other people or HR professionals might be, but if I see bullets that are different sizes, that immediately is something that I’m aware of I don’t think that I would turn anybody down for that but it does just jump out at me as, “okay, maybe not an attention to detail person” And so I think the way that we present things visually, I think is misunderstood by some people. Maybe not in communications, but in non-profits in general. They don’t understand how important it is to have a professional designer who really knows what they’re doing.

And I think there’s both a good and bad side to there being kind of DIY software out there. I won’t name the name that I think we’re all thinking that program can be very helpful, but I think it also has made a lot of people think that they can do the stuff that is probably better done by a professional.

David Pisarek: Earlier on in my career, when I was working at the college and the university, one of the things that I did was I created templates that had locked components to it. So, like, you couldn’t change fonts, but you can go and you can put in your own copy so that it could be shared across departments. And we know that it was on the brand end.

So, for example, as you were talking, I was like, “All right, canvas is probably the tool that you’re thinking of.” Very different than Photoshop or Illustrator but having templates created for your organization where it’s like, “all right, here are the guidelines on how to properly use them,” can empower you to actually do more without having to worry that you’re going off brand or that it’s going to not look great.

We want to have a seamless feel and content as you’re walking through. So, like, even the tone and style of the messaging should be very similar across the organization and should resonate with the audience. The Persona that you’ve put together.

Randy Ford: Yeah.

David Pisarek: And you need to share that across the organization. It’s not enough to just make it and put it up on your intranet or save it on a network drive or Dropbox or send out an email, actually consult with the people in your organization.

Whether you’re a small organization of two or three, or you’ve got three or 400 people, you want to make sure the people really understand, “Here is the brand guide.”

And when we talk about the brand guides, often, at least in my experience, and what I hear from my clients is, “Oh, okay, like logo colours, acceptable use,” things like that.

A lot of organizations don’t have a written style guide. Like, do you follow the Canadian press style or apa? You know, even down to job titles.

I’ve seen organizations do all lowercase. I’ve seen all uppercase. When you write somebody’s phone number, and they have a telephone extension, do you put ext. Ex. E.? Even the minutia of that, if it’s the same across the organization, you’re going to come across as more professional when people look at what you’re doing.

Randy Ford: And a little bit of a tangent here, but since you mentioned job titles, I think that’s another important storytelling thing, not just visually. Well, how is that conveyed to another audience?

In other words, is that title an internal title because there’s a career ladder written somewhere in the employee handbook? Or is that title, when someone sees it on a business card or in a signature block, gonna tell them what that person can do for them? In other words, if somebody’s title is “Director 2,” that tells me nothing as someone outside the organization about that person.

I know someone who this was years ago, worked at an Amazon facility, and her title was officially “Problem Solver,” which was great. And that is still what she is best at doing. And I think it doesn’t have to be that style, but something that says, you know, “this person is director of Member relations.”

David Pisarek: Exactly. So I’m curious, do you have any examples of non-profits that use storytelling effectively?

Randy Ford: Right now, the biggest ones, and I almost always stop and watch them, are the children’s healthcare providers.

So, I’m talking about St. Jude Shriners and Easter Seals. They’re not focused on facilities. They’re not focused on “look who our donors are.” They are focused on the families whose lives have been touched because St. Jude cured their child of cancer.

And we hear from that child, we might hear from the provider, we might hear from the mother or a parent. And it’s really effective. I really put those up as a model for people. And if you haven’t seen them, go just search any of those and watch.

David Pisarek: If you’re struggling with where do I find these stories, I would start internally. Talk to the leadership of the organization, talk to the board of directors, get them to answer this question: why is it that you care about this organization?

Randy Ford: Yeah, right.

David Pisarek: There’s some story there, there is a reason behind there. Talk to volunteers who are coming, talk to patients or people who are coming for programs and services, “How is this helping you?” Some very simple questions like that that’ll get you a plethora of ideas and content.

And I think you can take that and then leverage that to prod, produce more similar kind of content and tell the stories of the people. And that can drive a lot of emotional connection for people as well.

Randy Ford: Yeah, absolutely. And the organization happens to have events. I think a great person to talk to is whoever works at the registration desk to find out who are the real characters who’ve come up here and seem to have a story that we can share or, you know, if not the people who interact with members as they sign up or in any capacity.

Those people know who is interesting. They also know who to stay away from. So, they are always a good place to start, I guess.

David Pisarek: Fantastic, Randy. Amazing insights about storytelling, how people listening have been able to get some really great advice, some tidbits, a pointer at least something like that. If anybody wants to get in touch with you, they want to talk about storytelling a little bit further. What do they need to do?

Randy Ford: Look me up on LinkedIn for story strategies or by my name, Randy Ford in Chicago. There’s not a ton of us.

Go to my website, firststorystrategies.com. I’m always happy to chat, so send me a note at any of those places and I would love to get together and do a virtual chat.

David Pisarek: Amazing, Randy. Thank you again for joining the non-profit Digital Success podcast. Is everybody listening? If you want any of the things that we talked about, we have the entire transcription that we’re posting with this episode as well.

Just head over to our podcast page at nonprofitdigitalsuccess.com, click on this episode for all the details, and until next time, keep on being successful.

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